"STAR TREK Into Darkness" - 2013

WillEagle · February 08, 2013, 03:04:05 PM

I need to go find the new EW!

Rico · February 10, 2013, 05:19:52 AM

I had some thoughts on my speculations on the possible plot this morning. A few things we can probably gather from the trailers:

Harrison was or is in Starfleet
He is "better" than us at everything
The Klingons are involved
Kirk messes up and then has to save things
Carol Marcus (a scientist) is involved
Harrison is really pissed at Starfleet

My guess is Harrison was in Starfleet, maybe even in the past. Klingons I think bring in the augment angle (as seen on Enterprise). Harrison and maybe his crew or others become augments - maybe not by their choice. Things go wrong. People die. And now Harrison is out for blood. Kirk might be involved in some of this - maybe finds Harrison and his people in cryo-sleep somewhere. Lets them out maybe. Harrison takes the title of, Khan. Let the fun begin!

Just some rough guess work on my part. Anyway, fun to think about.

Dangelus · February 10, 2013, 08:54:51 AM

I like the sound of that plot premise but if they shoe horn in that Harrison is Khan (which is totally unnecessary for this story to work) it will be disappointing. It shows they don't have the balls to run with a good story without having this name check to TOS history.

Rico · February 10, 2013, 09:36:23 AM

Quote from: Dangelus on February 10, 2013, 08:54:51 AM
I like the sound of that plot premise but if they shoe horn in that Harrison is Khan (which is totally unnecessary for this story to work) it will be disappointing. It shows they don't have the balls to run with a good story without having this name check to TOS history.

I don't really agree. To me, it would be even more weird if he is basically Khan in all but his name. An augmented, genetically superior human who takes revenge against Star Fleet. And his name is, John Harrison?!?! I mean come on. If you basically are running with such a similar story and don't have him use the name Khan at some point - that makes no sense to me. If this were a completely original story, then yes I agree. But at this point, it seems like that isn't the case.

Bryancd · February 10, 2013, 10:02:48 AM

Well, we know he is in Starfleet, the writers have confirmed that. So John Harrison is a Starfleet officer who somehow develops what appears to be superior strength and possibly intellect, is somehow on a Klingon planet at some point, returns to Earth a terrorist who offers the parents of a dying child hope, and he blows up a lot if crap and challenges Kirk to defend his family. Makes perfect sense, he's Harry Mudd. ;)

Bryancd · February 10, 2013, 10:07:33 AM

Quote from: Dangelus on February 10, 2013, 08:54:51 AM
I like the sound of that plot premise but if they shoe horn in that Harrison is Khan (which is totally unnecessary for this story to work) it will be disappointing. It shows they don't have the balls to run with a good story without having this name check to TOS history.

I am of two minds on this. Part of be is excited to see a new version of a Khan story, after all it's been 21 years since TWOK and the augment story was picked up in Enterprise to some success. Another part of me face palms in disbelief why they couldn't come up with something new. I have a feeling they are going to split the difference, give us a Khan like story but with a totally new take on it. That would explain the draconian secrecy surrounding it. Any whiff of Khan too soon would have people up in arms and JJ likely doesn't want that expectation from audiences.

Dangelus · February 10, 2013, 11:19:30 AM

I'm not saying a Khan storyline would be bad but if this is Khan it is in name only. The augment story in Enterprise was great and this could new seen as an offshoot from that. My personal opinion is of they are going to do Khan then they should stick to his roots a little more. He should be that Sikh emperor figure of Indian descent. Why bother to change so much then attach the name Khan to the story? Let the script stand on it's own I say.

X · February 10, 2013, 03:43:12 PM

Quote from: Dangelus on February 10, 2013, 11:19:30 AM
I'm not saying a Khan storyline would be bad but if this is Khan it is in name only. The augment story in Enterprise was great and this could new seen as an offshoot from that. My personal opinion is of they are going to do Khan then they should stick to his roots a little more. He should be that Sikh emperor figure of Indian descent. Why bother to change so much then attach the name Khan to the story? Let the script stand on it's own I say.

Here is something to consider. we really don't know the ethnic heritage of Khan. We assume indian, but at the same time, they explain that most of the augments were built genetically. He could have a latin heritage, but was merely born and raised in India.

Also, and I think that a lot of people have missed this. His actual name is Khan. That's his first name, not a title.

Rico · February 10, 2013, 05:03:08 PM

I'm very well aware that Khan was the character's first name in the original series. But, what I've been saying is that most likely is being changed in the JJ-verse (as could his genetic heritage). And, one way to do that would be if the character takes the name Khan possibly as a title in the new movie. Just an idea.

X · February 10, 2013, 05:26:29 PM

Quote from: Rico on February 10, 2013, 05:03:08 PM
I'm very well aware that Khan was the character's first name in the original series. But, what I've been saying is that most likely is being changed in the JJ-verse (as could his genetic heritage). And, one way to do that would be if the character takes the name Khan possibly as a title in the new movie. Just an idea.

I know that you're aware, but some people think that it's more a title than a name.

Bryancd · February 10, 2013, 06:40:07 PM

Yeah, I always considered Khan as a name, not an honorific.

Dangelus · February 10, 2013, 10:14:06 PM

Yes he is genetically engineered and could all have been brought up in India in the prime universe. That's my point. He has an Indian Sikh name! Khan Singh! So if this is the same character and in this universe he was raised in Berkshire, England then it makes no sense to attach that name to him. That being said if they go that route it will be very interesting to see how they explain it. If they don't bother then I will lose all respect for this creative team and assume they are just casing in on Trek history.

Feathers · February 11, 2013, 03:04:58 AM

With possible links between this second film and the last second film, I'm starting to worry what we'll get for the fifth iteration of this new franchise. Meeting a character who is God in name only... hang on, we've already done that!

Honestly, I'm fairly easy on whatever they choose to do for this. Maybe it's a character flaw on my part but I'm generally happy to go along for the ride with most films as long as they're enjoyable to watch.

Rico · February 11, 2013, 05:47:35 AM

Quote from: Dangelus on February 10, 2013, 10:14:06 PM
Yes he is genetically engineered and could all have been brought up in India in the prime universe. That's my point. He has an Indian Sikh name! Khan Singh! So if this is the same character and in this universe he was raised in Berkshire, England then it makes no sense to attach that name to him. That being said if they go that route it will be very interesting to see how they explain it. If they don't bother then I will lose all respect for this creative team and assume they are just casing in on Trek history.

I think you are missing one important thing Dan. A name doesn't have to denote heritage - especially of someone that was probably genetically engineered. Maybe his "creators" named him? Or maybe he just takes the name later on for himself?

One thing I find interesting about this whole situation is that wasn't the point to go off into an alternate universe the chance to give them the ability to do pretty much anything they want? Once we see the film we will know more, but in a way they still seem to be trying to hang on to 47 or so years of Trek history - at least to some degree.

Bryancd · February 11, 2013, 06:10:53 AM

Quote from: Rico on February 11, 2013, 05:47:35 AM
Quote from: Dangelus on February 10, 2013, 10:14:06 PM
Yes he is genetically engineered and could all have been brought up in India in the prime universe. That's my point. He has an Indian Sikh name! Khan Singh! So if this is the same character and in this universe he was raised in Berkshire, England then it makes no sense to attach that name to him. That being said if they go that route it will be very interesting to see how they explain it. If they don't bother then I will lose all respect for this creative team and assume they are just casing in on Trek history.

I think you are missing one important thing Dan. A name doesn't have to denote heritage - especially of someone that was probably genetically engineered. Maybe his "creators" named him? Or maybe he just takes the name later on for himself?

One thing I find interesting about this whole situation is that wasn't the point to go off into an alternate universe the chance to give them the ability to do pretty much anything they want? Once we see the film we will know more, but in a way they still seem to be trying to hang on to 47 or so years of Trek history - at least to some degree.

Yeah, which is why this seems so odd. They have a blank slate after establishing the rules for this new universe and timeline but seem to be recycling stories, characters, and situations.